Regarding this map and Sam

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Regarding this map and Sam

Post by UnRequired on Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:05 am

This map is horridly unbalanced.

9 times out of 10 you get a ridiculous spawn of dinos inside your base at a stupid early point in the game. I would like to see ANY replay of someone fending off 2 Spinos and 3 Juvinille T-Rex in the first 8 minutes of the game.

The point of labeling something as a "base" is it provides some degree of protection or advantage that the other areas of the map do not. This clealy is not the case with this map. Have you not played the Warcraft 3 campaign or standard maps?

Resources are too scarce at the begining of the game and too easy to come by later in the game. If you do manage to survive the initial spawning of dinos the game becomes too easy with 4-5 Helix Laser towers eliminating most problems

Finally to you Sam, it is extremely disrespectful to take a project like this map and turn it into completely unbalanced trash. You do real mapmakes who actually play test their maps and try to put out a nice piece of work a bad name. Thats why your other map, Vampirism Speed is almost dead.

So in closing here are my suggestions.

1) Make defending your "Base" not cost an arm and a leg
2) Any future projects need actual PLAY TESTING before any release
3) Learn what a BASE is (perhaps look at your other map, Vamp Speed)
4) Learn to make the map a CHALLENGE the entire game through, and not just "If you make it past the first 20 minutes of bullshit you win

Finally if you don't like those suggestions, I'll put number 5 in

5) Quit making maps.

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Re: Regarding this map and Sam

Post by rqx on Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:43 am

A little too negative there.. No one's forcing you to play this map

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Re: Regarding this map and Sam

Post by UnRequired on Tue Mar 09, 2010 12:34 pm

So I should sugar coat it? The fact is this project was taken from someone else and it was shit all over. As someone who works closely with mapmakers I know how much of an insult that is. Should it just be excused?

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Re: Regarding this map and Sam

Post by rqx on Tue Mar 09, 2010 1:02 pm

Please cite examples of Jurassic Park maps that are better than sam's version

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Re: Regarding this map and Sam

Post by Bad-JeIly-BeIIy on Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:29 pm

1. Learn to build a gun shop and tranquilize the dinosaurs, A.K.A ( Sleep from Dreadlord ) IF you played the campaign/standard maps.
2. Play Jurassic 2 60 minutes mode.
3. Go play melee ladder if you hate this map so much and/or DotA.
4. No one is forcing you to play
5. I would like to see you make a better Jurassic Map.

and last of all
6. List Jurassic Park maps that are better than Sam's map (rqx)
7. You are obviously a troll

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Re: Regarding this map and Sam

Post by UnRequired on Thu Mar 11, 2010 4:36 am

1) A better map - http://www.epicwar.com/maps/1018/

2) You suggest J2 60 min. You obviously didn't read my post. Failure troll is a failure.

3) No one has a tranq gun in the first 6-8 minutes of play unless they just letting dinos walk into their "base"

4) J2 60 min is exactly the same as I described if not more so because if you fend off the initial onslaught its more dinos and more money which means you just "dig in" faster

5) Never claimed I could make a better one, just dont shit on other people's work and portray yours as better.

6) No one has stated any valid counter arguements to the points I have portrayed.

The bottom line is the map is bad. No one is forcing me to play so guess what? I don't. But that has no bearing on whether I come here and state the truth about it.

If you post again Bad-jelly-belly or whatever assortment of "I"s you have mixed in there I would suggest you.

1) Read the post precisely with relationship to the time and context of things mentioned

2) Actually have a rebutal to the stated arguements that actually addresses them and doesn't just dodge them

3) Accept the fact that while you may not like what I have to say it in no way will make it less valid or less honest. As they say the truth hurts

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Re: Regarding this map and Sam

Post by theorchero on Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:55 am

I'll give you this: Your a fair arguer. And since i'm rather new here, and have played this game so much I fear it threatens my health, my opinion should be unbiased and informed.

I completely agree. Maybe a little negative, but agreed.

It can be bullshit the first few minutes of the game, but the rest of the game can be easy. I guess the only real hard parts of the game is the beginning and getting to the damn copter and actually getting on it.

The way they make it "harder" is by adding more dinos. That doesn't work, because you can just kill them faster, getting more gold, thus more towers and upgrades; I've had games where I've fully specialized two paths and still managed to get my robot! The other bad point about spawning more and more dinos is that it creates EFL. Epic Fucking Lag. Seriously. Although it is based off timelimit and your computers capabilities, there's no hope, someone is eventually going to bitch about it being laggy.

My sudgestion to fix the lag and the imbalance is to make the dinos stronger, don't mass them, just keep making them stronger (not 3 intervals of a little +dmg).

As to the costs: Agreed. It is a pain in the ass to get stuff done early game, yet way too easy late game. This has balance issues, obviously... Oh, and I sudgest sam that you make regions that cover the pinged "bases so those damn dinos don't spawn in there (or if you can't help that, make a trigger so if they SPAWN in an active base, they get moved to another random location).

Testing: That's common sense, any mapmaker needs to thoroughly test his/her map fully to it's normal capabilities to detect any inconsistences or bugs; let the players handle/report on any bugs that happen in unusual circmstances.

Base: Not sure what you mean here; I think you mean that the bases aren't really "bases" (the cookie cutter bases like in vampirism games) but I have to agree with you, some bases that are marked as such just don't make much sense, but this is Jurassic Park, they are not going to have conviently made-out places for you to stick your towers out to own everyone! XD

Challenge: I believe I addressed this earlier, but I will reilleterate. I agree, the game is too much of a pain in the ass to begin with (if a dino is in your base in beginning, GG for that base) and incredibly easy later on (several helix's can take care of nearly any threat), excluding the occasionally limited health of walls (but you can make massed tents xD).

Quit Making Maps: Kind of harsh, don't you think? I agree that someone who knows that is issues in their map, claim to upkeep it, but refuse to fix any bugs or issues shouldn't "edit" that particular map, maybe not at all, but sam has done a reasonable job compared to some other editors, he has added quite a bit of content; Who else has save/load codes and rewards?

For all its worth, I appreciate you coming to take the time to address your concerns (assuming the issues will be dealt with) to help improve the map.
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